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Post by twrich on Mar 6, 2006 7:05:22 GMT
Glorfindel! Hhmmm, I forgot about him.
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Post by Gildor on Mar 6, 2006 9:11:40 GMT
well wendy, I don't know if the Turin series is an aberation, but if it has not been casted in many numbers, making both Turin series very rare and hard to find that certainly comes from a "little licence problem" and not wanting to draw too much attention... I suppose (I don't see Mithril as Tolkien reinvention at all, at least not since they focused on the books rather than MERP material , but well, that's what Christopher Tolkien thinks about it that imports... and for him any visual representation except his own father illustrations, are somekind of reinvention, only a few artists are allowed) There is an example of a picture skectch made by Ted Nasmith, illustrating Eru ins his grandeur (like a Christian God ) during the Ainulindalë and Melkor singing against the other Ainur. This picture can be found on Ted Nasmith website, it is magnificient, but well... no wonder why it has remained a sketch and not used officially in any work...
But I wonder off the topic ... well "an elf lord with jewel" is maybe a bit too obvious a title, you don't see many elves with remarkable jewels in LoTR... On the opposite, you could perfectly design a "Noldo Elf Lord".. (not necessarily with a jewel) and that could fit perfectly in the LOTR licence... (Gil-Galad is a Noldo, many elves during the last alliance are also Noldor, though most are Sindar, Glorfindel is a Noldo too, and Gildor too, even Erestor maybe)
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Post by Thanniel on Mar 6, 2006 10:20:21 GMT
Hi fellows!
Here is my suggestion for a vignette. I think about the moment when Gandalf comes back as the White and is founded by Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas. Gandalf can be dresed in cloak and hood over his head, while his friends are raising their weapons, fearing about the fact that it could be Saruman. Maybe a expensive 4 figures vignette, but i hope you find it nice.
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Post by estel on Mar 6, 2006 13:15:17 GMT
Hi Gildor,
I wished that you were right. I would think it is better, that NO ONE ELSE produces miniatures of the Silmarillon, if they are not made by MITHRIL/Chris Tubb. BUT there are rumours and some hints, that Games Workshop HAD bought the rights to do miniatures taken from the Silmarillon. I like the Turin range of MITHRIL very very much, but I hate the idea of seeing my beloved heroes carved out of metal by Games Workshop (maybe with big swords, axes, and non-character-faces). I wished, that Christoper Tolkien would install an inquisition to catch all those folk, making "toys" out of the Silmarillon characters- MITHRIl never did. They stuck extraordinaryly to the words written in the books!
KRGDS Estel (always in hope, that Games workshop will NOT realize its Silmarillon project)
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Post by Gildor on Mar 6, 2006 14:06:56 GMT
Frankly Estel, I doubt Christopher Tolkien will let this "violation" unpunished. As I assure you that there is absolutly no rights to be bought from T.Enterprise about it... it is simply that they are doing it without licence agreement, and their popularity covers them in case of court trials but I doubt they would keep that "opportunity" for long... Tolkien Enterprise cannot sell what they do not possess thus if games workshop has somekind of "licence" it must be from somewhere else than Tolkien Enterprise and I doubt it is from Tolkien Estate as these are only focused on writing matters. Indeed these could only be rumors. let's wait to see a Beren, Tuor, Feanor or other people from Games Workshop to conclude anything. So far even NewLine has not been able to get rights to make Silmarillion movies, and they could pay billions to do that, but they simply cannot have the rights no matter the money... They even have problems about licences for the Hobbit lol... I rest assured that no Silmarillion project will see daylight, and if so, they would be put into nightshadow as quickly as the Morgul Night can spread I have been in contact with too many people who have tried to do so...and "broke their teeth" on the project... Besides, in matter of legislation, I am not good at it, but I think that if it is allowed for Games Workshop, that makes a "jurisprudence" or "antecedent" as we call it in french, which would be a crack in tolkien estate protection, and allow , legally, other companies to do the same. I will try to grab some info .... (PS : Michael, maybe you should put these last posts in another conversation, as it is indeed an interesting one but it floods the suggestion topic and I feel very ashamed about that, being the one who initiated the debate...)
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Post by voivalvatti on Mar 6, 2006 16:51:05 GMT
Our suggestion:
"Pyre of Denethor"
"Then Gandalf seeing the madness that was on him feared that he had already done some evil deed, and he thrust forward, with Beregon and Pippin behind him, while Denethor gave back until he stood beside the table within. But there they found Faramir, still dreaming in his fever, lying upon the table. Wood was piled under it, and high all about it, and all was drenched with oil, even the garments of Faramir and the coverlets; but as yet no fire had been set to the fuel."
This could make quite a dramatic vignette... Could be without Beregon and Pippin: Gandalf approaching Denethor. Faramir on the table.
With very small detail: there's palantír hidden in Denethor's pillow which is on the table...
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Post by gilgaladtolkien on Mar 6, 2006 22:42:31 GMT
My march suggestion is a
Chariot Driver of Rhun
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Post by ddaines on Mar 7, 2006 0:50:51 GMT
I would second the Pippin/Beregond figures (to go with the new Troll), however as a possibly new suggestion how about Gandalf and Aragorn with the new sapling of the White Tree.
David.
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Post by estel on Mar 7, 2006 6:43:05 GMT
Hi Gildor,
I hope, that it is true, that no Feanor, no Turin and all the others will be realized in future (except by Mithril, which seems to be unrealistic)! Maybe Chris Tubb and the Mithril staff should try to convince Christopher Tolkien, that it is better to let some things be legend and in the mind of people and that their vision is conservative, meaning very near to the books. Like Chris T., I never liked the idea of creating some characters, like a vision of Sauron in the 3rd Age (he is an unvisible threat and that makes him much more dreadful). What I think is much more delicate is not the look of a possible miniature (from Feanor for example) but how to PAINT it.
I agree, that maybe a new thread has to be opened, because the discussion is quite interesting. I got some pain in my stomach, when I read, in the Internet, that GW has bougth the license for Silmarillon minis.
Bye
and as some say:
We will meet again, if all armies of Mordor.. and so on..
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Post by Gildor on Mar 7, 2006 8:48:40 GMT
as I told you in private, there is no license to be bought from Silmarillion, how can you buy something that does not exist (I do not say something not "for sale" as everything can be bought , but something that does not exist is impossible) as for Mithril trying to convince Christopher Tolkien, I would be very very cautious on how to approach this man... as for Sauron, or other figures I understand it can be hard indeed! I submitted the Sauron idea, and while I have painted the base, Elendil & Gil-Galad I still cannot figure out HOW I will paint the Sauron figurine lol. As for Sauron in 3rd Age, in Tolkien communities there is a debate to know if whether or not Sauron has a physical body (the dilemna comes from the fact there was a "necromancer in Dol Guldur" which at first was thought to be a nazgul but ended up being Sauron himself...thus the debate... Ral-Partha or Citadel made a Sauron figurine (a sort of thorny throne with an Eye incrusted in it) if I remember well, but it was back before Mithril existence I think (PS : Please Michael, I really think this conversation should carry on, but elsewhere , can you do something about it ? Thanks in advance)
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Post by khador on Mar 7, 2006 13:36:23 GMT
Hi Gildor, I hope, that it is true, that no Feanor, no Turin and all the others will be realized in future (except by Mithril, which seems to be unrealistic)! Like Chris T., I never liked the idea of creating some characters, like a vision of Sauron in the 3rd Age (he is an unvisible threat and that makes him much more dreadful). What I think is much more delicate is not the look of a possible miniature (from Feanor for example) but how to PAINT it . I got some pain in my stomach, when I read, in the Internet, that GW has bougth the license for Silmarillon minis I'm reading for 2 days conversation between Estel and Gildor and I think the debate in not really in this forum, but I want to tell to Estel : 1) This forum only concerns Mithril miniatures !! 2) I don't know what about The Silmarillion's license rights and I think that for all of us, it is not our problem (I'm sorry to say it, but you as I, won't change Tolkien Enterprise's decisions about JRRT's books rights) 3) I like (very very much) Mithril miniatures AND I also like (very very much) Citadel miniatures and Games Workshop's products (especially LOTR miniatures), I'm sure it's compatible to like all of that in the same time !! 4) If you think Games Workshop's products are "toys", I'm sorry to tell to you that Mithril as produced several miniatures for MERP (another "toy" from I.C.E., which wasn't very appreciated by Christopher TOLKIEN if I have well understood) 5) If you never want to see a miniature which is representing special character as Feanor, Sauron, Beren, Tuor, or anyone other ... (made by Mithril or by Games Workshop...) I give you quite wise advices : - don't buy no more longer Mithril minatures (you are not dragooned to buy all of the miniatures produced about TOLKIEN's books on earth). I hope that it isn't necessary to put under arrest Peter JACKSON, John HOWE, Ted NASMITH and all other persons who have created representations of legendary characters from LOTR. Best regards
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Post by estel on Mar 8, 2006 8:49:33 GMT
Morning, just a last quote: 1.) I do like ALL of the Mithril miniatures!! They are (in my opinion) the very best you can buy as miniatures for LotR. 2.) I do collect most of the GW products of LOTR, but I hate the idea of creating new special characters! 3.) I do like very much the drawings of John Howe, Alan Lee and Ted Naismith and the ideas of Chris Tubb. 4.) There is a difference in WHY miniatures are created. If you know Chris Tubb and Mithril well, you have to know, that they try to keep as near to the books as possible and NOT to create toys for a game. This is just my opinion. 5.) I do not want to quarrel with any one of the fellowship members or any other collector, as this is not my nature. I just tried to get informations, which Gildor gave me- thank you Gildor, gave me some hope. 6.) As Gildor, I think that this is not the right thread to discuss Regards Estel
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Post by khador on Mar 8, 2006 9:44:00 GMT
Estel,
agree your last post and I do not want quarrel with anyone. You're right on the reasons why Mithril miniatures are NOW created and produced (not the same one in the past, Mithril miniatures are more figures for MERP game) and if I think Mithril figures are very very beautiful (epic miniatures for epic books) I think (sorry Chris) that quite details are different between miniatures and books (I like all of Mithril miniatures but certain persons (not me) are rude with the fact elves don't get peeved ears, or with the fact that 7 on 9 nazgul are unamed, or with the presence of characters who aren't name or signalized on the books (Hundin, Razarac, Zalg, Saviga...)). In definitive, I think we do not border (with such and such details which is not the same as...) creations of LOTR miniatures and Mithril miniatures (in particular). This collection is like an opened door on the extraordinary imaginary world of Middle-earth ; all representations of characters are welcomed to make us feel It.
Thanks
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Post by Gildor on Mar 8, 2006 14:33:19 GMT
I think that Hundin, Zalg, nazgul names for sure and such names were invented by ICE and when they lost their licence, Tolkien Enterprise got possession of the names created by ICE, thus they are used under licence even if they are from an "extended tolkien universe" ... I have always found it strange that Tolkien Entreprises tolerates that, but the ways of marketing are sometimes hard to understand. Some details too are not 100% similar to the books but we can't blame anyone about that! that's hard to take care of every detail.. (such as the heraldic designs for each elf family crests (house of gil-galad for example)
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Post by khador on Mar 9, 2006 11:53:19 GMT
I don't know if it's hard to find out of books but I believe these ones are a wonderful subject to explore which arouses our imagination and also our version of It. Designers (on films, arts, miniatures, roleplaying game...) must have a their version of Middle-earth, of its characters, of its History, of its countries and of its events, even though, individually, we don't agree with it.
I believe that meeting several versions of a same subject (event, character, sword, heraldic, shield, clothes, face, color of the eyes, size of nose hair ...ooh I believe I'm going too far) is a good maner to enjoy extraordinary wealth of Arda.
Regards
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Post by Gerold on Mar 9, 2006 13:47:00 GMT
I'll repeat my first suggestion of all : a Moria dwarf warrior. It doesn't has to be a character, just a dwarf figure in action pose, in full armour dress, with a helm with eye and nose protector, plate or chain mail, and a special weapon, like defending with a long pike or a long hallbeard (you know, a long kind of axe).
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Post by Ori on Mar 9, 2006 15:24:54 GMT
I like gdemarsin suggestion. But I would be more specific. Lets say Frár, Lóni and Náli fighting and dying in Moria, in the second chamber.
I would like to recover a past suggestion. It would be mounted prince Imrahil. But I cant remember if it was suggested in the following way. If yes, please forgive me.
It will be a mounted prince Imrahil coming back to Minas Tirith with wounded Faramir "And now were the swan knights coming back, followed by Dol-Amroth standard bearer and the prince. And in Imrahils arms, over the ¿cross? of the horse, Faramir, son of Denethor, recovered in the battlefield"
Vow, it is quite hard to translate from Spanish to English
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Post by ddaines on Mar 9, 2006 19:07:37 GMT
Hi Ori, re your Imrahil/Faramir suggestion I did originally submit this idea along with a sketch in the gallery. I can't remember how it fared vote wise, but obviously didn't make it to the final production run.
I still live in hope though and who knows, one day!
David
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Post by Ori on Mar 9, 2006 20:30:28 GMT
Right! Now I remember. I am getting old.... It maybe a difficult one to be made.
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Post by Ori on Mar 10, 2006 11:11:23 GMT
Well...
Thorin in his tomb in erebor with the arkenstone over his chest.
Has it been suggested?
I like dwarves. I hope to see the boxed set of all "The Hobbit" dwarves soon.
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Post by Axe99 on Mar 14, 2006 8:34:20 GMT
So many great suggestions (and a very evocative and apt description of a snow-troll). I think I'll keep my powder dry again this month, and enjoy voting for what's already been posted . I particularly like the idea of Eorl on Felarof, not least because of Barly's persistence!
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