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Post by Gildor on Dec 21, 2006 23:02:48 GMT
The problem with PA France has somewhat been solved in the fact that people can now buy directly from Mithril (It is quite new, since the lossarnach army problem... it was still not released 6 months after the release in Ireland...) Mithril had agreements with prince-august France and any web browser where you would write www.mithril.ie would redirect directly to prince-august.net instead, thus forbidding access to the Mithril website. This restriction has now been removed and we can order from the Irish website. BUT, not all french people do speak english, and very very few people are aware of Mithril existence, and sorry to quote brand... Lord of the rings figurines = GW figurines in everyone's minde around me... I have never met a single Mithril painter/collecter in these 5 last years. The problem is to reach the potential customers... and in France... except mouth to ear communication, there is no more way, as Retailers have agreements with PA France only and not at all with Mithril themselves (I even think they are forbidden to have any...) Thus, that removes all the retailer advertizing possibilities in France... for the moment at least. (not to mention that there is only a very SMALL number of figurines retailers who sell PA products, and among them, only a few who sell Mithril... Last time I checked there was only ONE figurine shop selling mithril in PARIS, and one in Marseille.... the main cities of France... The PA french site only references 26 shops in the entire France who MAY sell mithril....and most of them are not even STILL aware of the Lossarnach army existence well that's all for now... Michael (and maybe Lars... and maybe Chris) will have a lot of reading I fear, when they are back from vacations
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Post by Gildor on Dec 21, 2006 12:06:05 GMT
Well I too raised your karma, I hope there will be answers after the holidays from Mithril, but I agree with all of what you say... If collectors could officially do something to help Mithril "marketing" that could help... That was actually, the original goal of my database website... which I try to complete as fast as possible... but I need more info
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Post by Gildor on Dec 20, 2006 19:53:28 GMT
(having Lars Edman posting on this topic is astonishing but well the answers are very informative) I wish I could suggest solutions but I fear that in France there is none (because of PA France...) The main problem if I understand well is that you are forced to wait for retailers to contact you, since you have "middlemen" and cannot advertize by yourself... which is very annoying for retailers that have no contact with you and have too many things to take care about, without adding the fact to look for information by themselves...
The only way I think about is... "sponsorship" made by volunteers members.... This would cost nothing, but we, as the gold fellowship could become heralds (not necessarily officially) to the retailers... and the same way it is done with banks or "memberships" or subscription fees (with mobile phone) , each time Mithril gains new customers, the guy who helped getting more customers would have reductions... (indeed that is only possible , at first, for new gold fellowship customers) that's only a possibility... but the simple fact to have leaflets and the authorization to advertize with these leaflets would be a good thing
Now about commercial aspects... Do the retailers who are informed of your products can directly order "stock" to you without using the regular distribution way... It is not possible here in France... and I remember having a personnal problem when I ordered the Mumak, some time ago, directly to Mithril.... and Prince August France went mad after me... and even phoned me to "kindly ask" me to buy the mumak at my retailer shop ONLY....
well, I try to find solutions...
(PS : if you prefer this discussion to go private and not have technical issues discussed in private I can understand and I really would like to help promote Mithril, so don't hesitate to contact me in private message or mail)
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Post by Gildor on Dec 20, 2006 18:17:03 GMT
I think the main problem with the mail was the word "vulgar" which in english does not really mean the same as "vulgaire morceau de plomb " in french... I am french too... and in english that would be translated "common little piece of lead".... From my thesaurus dictionnary, the word vulgar has a very strong negative connotation... and I don't think you wanted to use this word... Now that could clarify this aspect (PS : please Michael, don't take my emails as offensive too, they are not . These were just some thoughts I had about the problems we have here, but that may not be the case everywhere )
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Post by Gildor on Dec 20, 2006 12:38:31 GMT
I agree with most points except that : not all "rpg retailers" have the desire or motivation to become "modern" and they simply do not want to use internet as a way to get informations on distributions. (many RPG shops here are "old fashionned" a bit like old booksellers and Internet is not for their "world") I think it is the same for ancient collectors. There is a lot of communication and possibilities given to the fellowship, but I think about all those people for whom Mithril is a passion... but the Internet has either nothing to do with mithril, or simply that they are reluctant to all those modern ways of communication and prefer those good old habits of going to a retailer full of smoke and dust and check for new things... This time is long gone , but many Mithril collectors from the beginning belong to this old time... I have the luck to be still quite young and well versed in computers, I have adapted myself... that can't be the case for everybody
(PS : that's another subject, but PA does not communicate well in France it seems...(that's what I was mentionning but that is another problem you are well aware about, you just need to check prince august french site to have proof of it : the last news to date is the release of "smaug triumphant"...)
I remember a time when a single Hobbit from the "M" range would cost less than 1€ while, of course, mounted soldiers, or trolls cost something like 4 or 5€... Troll still cost 4 or 5€ but it is a surprise to see a single hobbit, from the regular range, at the price of 5€... Also, there has not been any paper advertisement for releases, the only ones I saw lately was for lossarnach in PDF... but indeed it was courtesy of the retailers to print them and display them in their shops? (I don't know in other countries but in France, there are none) If all other companies were making the same I would not be perplex, but other companies (I won't quote their names again...) send ads, papers, posters, catalogues to retailers, in order to inform both the retailers and afficionados who go to their figurine retailer on the solely purpose of getting informed (I know many figurine collector... not Mithril related... and even nowadays, they would not think about consulting the internet to get info for figurines, that's the job of their retailers...)
Please, though I don't feel concerned, don't forget those type of collectors (and retailers?) who do not "pay a lot of attention" of what is going on on the internet and prefer the old way... Because if I understood well the mail of Landpruneir, his collector friends who gave up are in this case. (now that's only my point of view that's not a personnal request at all, nor I want to be insulting or criticize anything you do . As for myself, I still find all Chris works to be masterpieces and can't understand this "vulgar piece of lead" (not to mention it is not simple lead, and thus can't be vulgar at all lol)
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Post by Gildor on Dec 20, 2006 10:13:14 GMT
I must admit that reading this post brings sadness to me... I think the same, mostly, but I keep collecting because I love Tolkien, I love Chris miniatures, and I have reached so far in the collection that it would be a shame to stop now.... But it's true that when I see figurines reaching prices above 1000$, when I see less than 10 M releases a year, and when I see figurines promotional only and not for sale that need you to be at some place at a specific time to get them or get them via auctions, when I see that I have to order all the figurines online without even the ability to buy them in my retailer anymore (Actually for the last two years, it was me who informed my retailer of new mithril relases, PA did not communicate at all about new releases, to retailers)... well sometimes I have the strong desire to stop everything right away... That's a business oriented strategy indeed, but thats a vicious circle alas... I suppose Mithril needs more and new customers to keep its ability to produce figurines , getting new customers requires business strategies... business strategies tend to remove lots of "original and supporting" customers from the beginning from what you say, and that's understandable... The question is... with this method, will Mithril get more customers or lose more? which will lead to more and more "limited" editions and higher and higher prices until it reaches a point of no-return... I share your sadness deeply landpruneir, as a collector who began collecting back in 1993 ...But I fear there is nothing we can do about that except communicate our sadness to Mithril You must not also forget that from all the companies that were producing figurines "RPG oriented" back in the early 90's.... Mithril is one of the very last still alive, and they make all they can to stay alive while others have all closed...(I won't mention brands but I am sure you know many of them)
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Post by Gildor on Feb 15, 2008 13:05:11 GMT
I remember the MB279 base in resin too, I don't have a metallic one.. Resin is very detailed, and has an advantage of lead, in some circumstances : it won't budge, it is d**n solid and resistant! (no bending, no smoothing of details over time due to bad manipulation, no easy breaking) for figurines it is not a good point but for bases, and background it can be... Still, I agree with theobald... using resin is expensive, and could be interesting only for mass releases. not for little batches like the MS not to mention MX releases.
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Post by Gildor on Dec 9, 2007 23:07:24 GMT
I admit that depending on the price of such a project, I would gladly contribute too , so keep me in touch if you will (but remember that Mithril said that there was no discussion possible on the making of the gate! it can't be done -technically- in pewter metal...) But i am ready to help co-finance a project of a MX box or vignette with Celebrimbor Narvi and the gate... in resin then since pewter can't be used... but I doubt Mithril will ever want to consider it... MX batches are even smaller than MS batches, it would cost too much for them
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Post by Gildor on Nov 10, 2006 21:00:44 GMT
Well, I have recently ordered two glasscases for my figurines because I am desperatly lacking space to display them all, and I only display the painted ones. the other ones are still in blisters... or in small plastic zipbags for protection. (M16 is in a jewelry velvet ring box LOL) As for fellowship, this membership is incredible and excellent (I wear the sweatshirts often lately and am very proud of it, even at work) Fact is there are no figurines in this year that I dislike. There may be some that I like less than others... but my favorite remains... (though the most expensive) my suggesion, the MS435 Sauron at Gorgoroth. For me it is a dream come true, and I spent several months painting it in every detail...I really Like Boromir death too, Gothmog, and the King of the dead. As for the expression of feelings, my favorites are Faramir & Eowyn and Gilraen, which are really expressive.
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Post by Gildor on Nov 9, 2006 17:44:23 GMT
well I must agree that the "royal family of the fourth Age" (aragorn, arwen eldarion) represented with the same skill used to render the love, fear, and fleeing feelings in the Gilraen miniatures... well it would make something wonderful... indeed I also like all other ideas but as a "small vignette" that would really be cool.
(on the other hand, painting young aragorn in his mother's arms... will be quite a challenge, unless the top body of aragorn child is a separate part?)
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Post by Gildor on Nov 9, 2006 9:45:53 GMT
I agree with Axe. The figurine expression, posture is exclusive, never seen before in Mithril. and it really captures the emotional meaning of the fleeing to Rivendell.
As always, Chris has made a wonderful job!
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Post by Gildor on Nov 15, 2006 10:00:54 GMT
From what I heard, when MERP disappeared and ICE did not get licence anymore from tolkien enterprise... All the materials created by ICE on the tolkien universe became the property of Saul Zentz Tolkien Enterprise as "extended non-canonical tolkien material". And that's the reason why Mithril has been able to produce MERP figurines after MERP has ceased to exist. But correct me if I am wrong
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Post by Gildor on Nov 7, 2006 9:48:48 GMT
Until Christopher Tolkien is dead (which, alas... should not be so far from today, he is not very young) such licences cannot be purchased. Not trying to be morbid, but the only person blocking tolkien estates from selling "licensing possibilities" for derivated products is Christopher Tolkien... and mainly because his father delegated him as litterary executor before his death. His brothers are not so much into their father works and thus, the licence may be bought...Still, tolkien estates is not only composed by Christopher Tolkien, and thus buying rights from them would mean discussions with great libraries (of which I don't remember the names) in England and in New York as well as Bailie Klass-Tolkien (Christopher wife) and Michael Tolkien (Chris' nephew who lives in France) When GW talks about aquiring licences and to be patient... they "may" mean : "wait until the old annoying guy is dead, which should not take tooo long".... IF that is the case, then this is very mean, not to say evil...
Until that time, GW will have to wait, because no matter the price, no matter the pression, nobody can overule a dead man's will, the one of JRR Tolkien, who regretted the last days of his life, to have sold his two first books to some guys (allen & unwin, if I remember well) who then were bought back by Saul Zentz.
Oh and by the way, GW can only by licences from a licensing authority, which is Saul Zentz 'Tolkien Enterprises', so I think that this is rather Saul Zentz more than GW , who is trying to get licences from the Tolkien Estate
I may ask my mother who has been in contact with Michael Tolkien (who lives in Aix-en Provence as a linguistic professor if I remember well, Christopher himself lives in "Auvergne" and is very fond of mushrooms lol) if all those rumors are serious. As a member of the estate, and Christopher nephew, I suppose he may have informations. He is a very sympathetic person, from what I heard from my mother (who's a casual fantasy poetry writer)
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Post by Gildor on Dec 5, 2006 16:40:37 GMT
strange, a Christmas figurine that is not a personnality? that's strange... So far they have only been personnalities if I remember well
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Post by Gildor on Nov 21, 2006 11:30:17 GMT
there will be a christmas figure in 54mm for 2006 ?? (and there was none for 2005 alas )
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Post by Gildor on Nov 18, 2006 10:45:43 GMT
Well from the last email we received from Michael, it seems that some of the figures in this serie are not specifically MERP related. As a matter of fact, Malbeth and Aranarth are existing characters from the LoTR books (in appendices) . Though I doubt many people know of Malbeth, and I was surprised to see him in the mithril range, but gladly surprised
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Post by Gildor on Nov 3, 2006 9:17:48 GMT
Actually if I am guessing well, the new upcoming series should focus on the North region of Middle Earth. (thus, the realm of Arnor) I know Chris has been wanting to make a series for Arnor for quite some time but he did not have enough character ideas for a whole range in the north. Perhaps, picking character ideas in the MERP range may have solved his problem... But that's only a guess.
The fact that we have a Glorfindel vs Witch-King forthcoming (for the salute event) makes me think that Chris is indeed focusing on the events in the north during the Third Age and before the LOTR maybe. (actually Glorfindel vs witchking is an event occuring in Fornost, before the Siege of Angmar... and I had submited this idea in the fellowship... once...)
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Post by Gildor on Mar 25, 2007 18:58:21 GMT
Well Vanyar did not set foot at all in Middle Earth since the beginning of the First Age except at the end of the First Age in the host of the Valar... They may even have been provided in armor by Maiar armorsmiths instead of their own armorsmiths... No doubt that nobody except them should have special armors worn by nobody else on Middle Earth providing them superiority with their gear to resist without ANY difficulty the legions of Melkor while Noldor princes had quite spent thousand years to achieve what they did in a single striking battlle.
I agree with Bombadil when it comes to any elves except the 'host of the Valar', but as for them, no one can say for sure, they were after all exceptionnal.... Now indeed for Thranduil, I doubt this armor fits him because he is but a "simple" sinda lord... but in Mithril Range we have had plated elves several times already... including especially Gil-Galad recently. So to fit the whole Mithril range, plate armor is ok... It may not match with "tolkien conception" but it matches the Mithril range...
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Post by Gildor on Mar 24, 2007 15:00:33 GMT
I think this figurine is absolutly beautiful, and it looks quite like the Noldo Warrior rare M247 well actually if you "forget" it is Thranduil... this Elf could very well be a Vanya elf from the Host of the Valar in the First Age, or a Noldo warrior from the First Age too... No one knows for sure that these elves from the First Age did not have plate mail. Especially those coming from Aman with the most accomplished armorsmiths of Arda directed by Aulë himself.
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Gothy
Nov 3, 2006 9:11:09 GMT
Post by Gildor on Nov 3, 2006 9:11:09 GMT
I received them today too and I must admit they are indeed really great. (the undercoating is also perfect for both of them!!!) I had not noticed that the witch-king beint released at the same time as Gothmog actually mean that in the same package we have the commander and his second in command. Well, on the batterfield (after he has dismounted its fell beast) before the witch-king is overthrown.. that would made a perfect battle scene. This witch king against a single Eowyn... why not... And Gothmog not very far from there giving orders to troops (you will have noticed that both of them have their arms pointing afar , as if giving orders or preparing assault) that gives you ideas ddaines?
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Gothy
Oct 19, 2006 13:22:25 GMT
Post by Gildor on Oct 19, 2006 13:22:25 GMT
I must admit I am impressed about this figurine. The pose is excellent and the helmet makes it impossible to know what kind of person it is .. it could be a half-orc (very improbable) a black numenorean (like mouth of sauron but more fighter than diplomat.. mostly probable) a simple human, a nazgul (why not but improbable) I never thought it could be an orc actually so the way it is represented is great for me
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Post by Gildor on May 14, 2006 10:06:00 GMT
This figurine is great! I hope I will get it soon, I'd like to see the details on Thorin and the Arkenstone too!
By the way, Michael, as I see the reference for this one is MS453 and the last reference to date was MS442 does that mean that we have a scheduled plan (or references affected) for the next-to-come regular release (M443-M452) if so, I am really curious to know what it will be
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Post by Gildor on Oct 12, 2006 11:50:33 GMT
well , I have my own personnal database filled with all the figs I own and all the figs I have painted (checkboxes), this is actually THE database (fully filled already) that I planned to convert as a website. Also I keep all the blister cards and if I do not own the blister card I make a "fake" one , so that I have both a numeric database and a "paper" database to keep track of everything I have. (I admit it is quite easy to fill when you have all the M range still I am always afraid to miss one of the little parts of some unblistered figurines... but I think I checked them all and I have everything... except some three christmas figurines that will haunt me for the rest of my life...)
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Post by Gildor on Oct 18, 2006 8:43:58 GMT
insisting on the fact that we are an official fellowship (created by Mithril) and not only a community of passionate collectors without anything official could play in the balance... maybe... After all, they may have passed the contract with Mithril about the exclusivity of these 4000 without knowing the existence of the fellowship. Maybe their point of view would be different and more "open to negociations" if they were aware of us... Could you tell me what you think about it Michael?
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Post by Gildor on Oct 17, 2006 10:59:36 GMT
that's if the regular case is strict but I am talking about an "agreement" we could make with the organizers of the event
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Post by Gildor on Oct 16, 2006 8:28:40 GMT
Well thanks wendy for your offer - I just really hope that there could be something like just a hundred of them reserved for the fellowship for example , or maybe, ONE member of the fellowship goes to the event and gets them for the whole fellowship and then redispatch them (something like that)
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Post by Gildor on Oct 12, 2006 12:01:57 GMT
I think the problem comes mainly from brands like GW in general. Since they "overruled" the figurines market with their wargames figurines... now pewter miniature figurines ONLY mean wargames figurines for most people. the idea of figurines for collection, and display only is a bit alien to "new generations" of figurine customers (I do not use the word collector purposedly) Those who build diorama comes just after those who play wargames. You are right, the word "specialist" fits more than "elitist".... Still in the word specialist there is no notion of affordability. Anybody who wants to become specialist at one thing (usually) can work hard to get good at it. When it comes to being elitist , what I mean is that you have to fit the prerequisites (financially, socially, intellectually) to be able to keep up to one thing.
But my vision may be altered from the fact that I spent so much money on it until now (while I am no way a rich man), thinking i was done with great expenses and could now focus on painting and serenity in getting the new releases... (now that I have gathered all the M range) And as many of you are aware of it, the last auctions were frightful... so now when I hear about ebay, I'm growing anxious
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Post by Gildor on Oct 12, 2006 7:56:13 GMT
Actually , maybe I am not well informed, but being from France I never heard about the Salute event, nor what it is about. I did not even know its existence before this rumor of mithril package was announced. I can understand easily the desire of Mithril to touch as many potential customers as possible. I have no greater desire than seeing Mithril reach its "grandeur" of years ago. Though alas I think it is lost in France or in any country outside of UK & Ireland... that's a pity. Wish I could do something to change that (I wear the polo and sweat shirts each time i go painting.... to promote it ...) (maybe using the old style red blister for commercial releases would help, I have witnessed tons of people looking at a mithril figurines thinking it was GW because the blister was alike.... same color etc... Maybe it helps selling the figurine as a figurines, but it does no good to reckon Mithril as something "unique and different" )
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Post by Gildor on Oct 11, 2006 16:57:13 GMT
fact is, getting them may be easy (though I somehow doubt it)... but the price won't be... so many people will want that I doubt sellers will use "direct buy" option... and the price may be as high as several hundreds £ each (I do not even talk about the set, but only one of them) Over the years i have spent thousands of euros to buy old figurines which became naturally rare and I have a deep respect for this kind of rarity... It is not the case for artificial rarity and still it can reach higher prices than natural rarity...
What frightens me more is how Mithril is evolving , as I said, I have the real feeling that it becomes more and more oriented towards "limited editions" and "off-market" sales than regular sales... For example, It has become so elitist that there are less and less retailers in France that sell them and it is very rare to see someone who knows what mithril figurines are, in a roleplaying shop... Why? because there has been no Mithril for sale nor advertising campaign for more than 2 years.... Guess what, to get Lossarnach army now, in France, you either have to order from Mithril or (it seems at least) you can order from a prince august retailer who will then order them himself, but they are not available for direct buying, and not available at all in shops... I remember back in 1995 when I was beginning collecting them, there was ENTIRE walls of roleplaying shops filled with all the mithril range... now there are maybe two or three boxed sets in display, with dust...Second-hand figurines out of blister badly glued on a display glasscase... and nobody looks at them... (I have seen that in Marseille, Montpellier and Paris... which are no little towns...) and so....less customers = less money for Mithril...= need to get money from other sources....
but this is highly off topic. I should open another topic about my thoughts on that.
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Post by Gildor on Oct 11, 2006 14:17:48 GMT
I agree on certain points of view but using the regular range numbers for "exclusive figurines" is a bit odd... the only very rare figurines that costed royal ransoms were christmas figurines so far, with the last one reaching above £1000 on ebay, but these are not "regular series"... so I can accept that. Relaying on the scarce availabilty on ebay, with people ready to spend £1000 for less than 30 grams of pewter metal around is not something many collectors can afford, and the money does not even end up in Mithril business... At least there could be a plan for people getting there and getting some to dispatch them afterwards... It is quite disapointing indeed to see one of your own suggestions come to life, not in the fellowship, but outside and not even be able to have one.
Maybe I am wrong but it seems Mithril is becoming a "topnotch collector only" market... and an elitist one. If we compare the "regular releases" to the "collector and unique or exclusive releases" during year 2006... they are more "exclusive" releases (or auctions...) than "mass market" releases (correct me if I am wrong but there has been only the Lossarnach army released for mass market in the whole year 2006, of course year 2006 is not over yet ... so we never know). Sorry to seem rude, it is just disapointment.... but I can't help but think Mithril becomes more and more elitist... I hope that I'll be able to get one in a way or another without having to "sell an arm", which would be very annoying to paint them afterwards, lol...
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